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RDF and bio filter installation

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RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Sat Aug 06, 2011 9:40 am

I built my pond just one year ago in June and all is maturing nicely, good water parameters if a little dirty. I wanted to increase the flow and turnover of water so started looking at ways of doing this.

I upgraded the pump on my Nexus 310 from 10000 l/h to 15000 l/h, immediate improvements were made to water clarity but I was getting fines dragging through the K1 .

I added a glass filter and high pressure pump and within two days I had sparkling clear water. The down side was the sheer amount of water required to properly back wash the glass filter which needed doing daily this time of year. This was not such a problem until we thought about holidays. There was no way we could leave this setup for a week without any attention.


A Bakki shower was an option so I bought a 33000 l/h pump and made my own BHM shower. This increased turnover massively but we still had the problem of cleaning the Nexus/glass filter combination whilst away.

I followed a thread by Dave J on his home made RDF and did a bit of research. RDF would solve the problem and maintenance would be minimal. I ordered a KC30 several weeks ago from Chris at Kitsu Koi, it arrived yesterday, I installed it today and I will update this thread on how I did it over the next few days.

This is what I take out, Nexus 310, glass filter, pump and lots of pipes.


Last edited by alank on Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:51 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:21 am

alank wrote:I built my pond just one year ago in June and all is maturing nicely, good water parameters if a little dirty. I wanted to increase the flow and turnover of water so started looking at ways of doing this.

I upgraded the pump on my Nexus 310 from 10000 l/h to 15000 l/h, immediate improvements were made to water clarity but I was getting fines dragging through the K1 .

I added a glass filter and high pressure pump and within two days I had sparkling clear water. The down side was the sheer amount of water required to properly back wash the glass filter which needed doing daily this time of year. This was not such a problem until we thought about holidays. There was no way we could leave this setup for a week without any attantion.


A Bakki shower was an option so I bought a 33000 l/h pump and made my own BHM shower. This increased turnover massively but we still had the problem of cleaning the Nexus/glass filter combination whilst away.

I followed a thread by Dave J on his home made RDF and did a bit of research. RDF would solve the problem and maintenance would be minimal. I ordered a KC30 several weeks ago from Chris at Kitsu Koi, it arrived yesterday, I installed it today and I will update this thread on how I did it over the next few days.

This is what I take out, Nexus 310, glass filter, pump and lots of pipes.
[img][/img]

Sounds like One Almighty Pond Makeover Alan Shocked for a Member so NEW to KoiKeeping .... which I know has not been without incidence initially which we have ALL experienced ourselves

I remain in awe of your enthusiasm Sweetie Very Happy which I instinctively sensed from the outset Alan ..

Do keep us updated please Very Happy

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Sat Aug 06, 2011 10:01 pm

Well we get into a hobby, research build then read some more etc etc. Eventually, you learn from those who know. In this case, I learned that turning my pond over once every 2 1/2 hours was not ideal.

I am aiming for twice per hour, hence the new filter.

On with the thread, after cutting out most of the pipework, removing the glass filter was a chore as it was high up and very heavy. I couldn't take the glass out so I struggled a bit to say he least. Next was the Nexus, extremely tight as I built the pond after siting the Nexus.
[img][/img]

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Sat Aug 06, 2011 10:20 pm

Wow ... that Nexus does look a tight fit Alan.

On the K1 subject which I have not incorporated into any filters yet .... many like yourself complained of fines having been a problem which your RDF should eliminate completely.

Fines were a huge problem in my system when using K3 ..... Rolling Eyes


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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by HAN on Sun Aug 07, 2011 2:41 am

These are becoming more affordable and therefore more popular.



Look forward to the updates Alan.
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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:41 am

When I disconnected the Nexus, the 4" valve on the bottom drain leaked profusely. A bit annoying as it is only a year old and had been closed and opened less than 10 times in the year. I bought it from Cascade water Gardens in Bury with the Nexus and the rest of the kit. I mentioned the problem to the staff there and they replaced the valve without any questions asked. Great service from them as they have replaced other warranty items in the last few weeks.

As I needed to install a mid water drain to help get the throughput for the RDF, I had to drain over 50% of the water from the pond.
[img][/img]

After cutting the hole for the mid water drain, the fitting was inserted and sealed. Scary stuff drilling through your fiber glass pond wall.

[img][/img]

[img][/img][img][/img]
The koi were jumping like mad and getting injured so I was glad to get the water back on to start filling up again.

While it was filling up, I got busy cutting 80 mm out of the pond wall to allow for the installation of a 750 liter plastic tank that was to be the bio chamber. It just didn't feel right cutting away at the wall but I knew that once I had finished, and before the pond was full, the tank would be fitted, wall braced and filled with concrete in all the wall cavities.
[img][/img]
[img][/img]

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Sun Aug 07, 2011 6:49 am

Scary Shocked

What is the Bio-Tank Alan ? and what will it contain ?

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:49 am

The bio tank is a very strong water butt. I have modified it by cutting a large hole in the top for access to fit 2" connectors for the pumps. Air stones and a 60 or 80 liter pump will agitate 350 liters of K1 and discs. 750 liters is the biggest I could fit, a 1000 liter IBC tank would be better and a lot cheaper. The bio tank is fed directly from the KC30.

The KC30 arrived yesterday, Chris from Kitsu Koi delivered it personally after picking it up from Southampton docks on Thursday.



After fitting a bend or two and measuring up, there was no way it was going to fit in the available space. Slight mods were required with a saw.


Each spigot on the inlet side was cut back to 35 mm so that a 110 mm diameter bend would fit snugly to the side of the unit.


The remaining gap between the bio chamber and the unit was too small to get a 90 degree bend in so I measured up and fabricated a stainless steel transition piece.


This was attached to the unit with rubber connectors, a hole was marked and cut in the bio tank, sealant applied and bolted in position.


Enough for the day as I had been at it for 14 hours straight.

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:06 am

Must have felt like Xmas Sweetie when the KC30 arrived Very Happy

Can I copy those photos please Alan to share with other Koi Fora Members ?

If I remember rightly ... don`t you work with stainless steel secularly ?

So the BD goes to a `Bio` Tank ... then on to the RDF ... to DIY Bakki ?

Is the Bio Tank a settlement chamber of sorts ?

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Sun Aug 07, 2011 10:53 pm

Feel free to use the pictures Mio. The bottom drain, mid drain and skimmer go directly to the KC30 via 3 x 110 mm drains. The filtered water (40 micron) then goes into the bio tank where the rotifers etc do their thing. A pump in the bio tank sends 33000 l/h to my shower, whilst a Sequence 18000 sends water through 2 uv's and into the pond through 2 returns. I can get a many and varied current flow into the pond to keep the fish entertained. I now have a "spare" pump and filter attached on the other side of the pond, I will use this as a settlement chamber and pump water into the shower in winter to keep it ticking over. The 33000 l/h pump will be switched off.

I served my time as a sheet metal worker and have some machinery to do sheet metal in my workshop. It rarely gets used these days as I used it to build my off road cars. My job is testing dust and fume extraction systems for the COSHH regulations.


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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Sun Aug 07, 2011 11:31 pm

14 hrs straight hard graft ... All Kudos to your efforts Alan Very Happy

Do you have pics of the Shower you fabricated ? did you choose the TT type `Tower` option or trays after ?

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:34 am













Just needs another 2 boxes of BHM.

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:48 am

Excellent Alan Very Happy

I remember you looking into designs prior to making the Bakki..

DaveB has a similar design IF memory serves.

Mike mentioned not only much greater `Clarity`in the Water since incorporating his RDF`s .. but a subsequent lowering of the TDS too Cool

Let us know if such is the case with yours.

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RDF ?

Post by Admin on Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:44 am

Do you have it on a timer Alan ?

How is it performing so far ?

I would be Mesmerized myself being the `Gadget/Gizmo` fan I am Very Happy


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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Tue Aug 09, 2011 6:42 pm

We had sunday off as it was raining No The RDF has been running for three days now. The K1 was added to the bio chamber but modifications are needed to get it to work how I want it to. I will have to take out the whole installation to allow access to the bio tank so I can sink it 4" into the ground. When both pumps are running (51000 l/h), the water level in the chamber drops about 5" which prevents the k1 from circulating. It will be a couple of weeks before I can do this mod. For now, I am running on 33000 l/h and have removed 70 liters of k1. This has been placed in my other inbuilt bio chamber which has been restarted. The bio chamber is working well under these conditions. I will also make a stainless steel extension to the bio chamber to house the pumps which are currently in the bio tank. The pumps restrict movement of the K1.

The RDF is faultless and cleans itself as the dirt builds up. The pond is clear now and the cleaning cycle kicks in about every 20 minutes. No need for a timer as it cleans when the water level in the clean side drops, one 4 second turn of the drum reinstates the water level immediately. All done with a level probe which turns the drum and operates a jet pump to backwash the filter.

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Tue Aug 09, 2011 6:56 pm

Ahh Yes ... I remember Henk mentioning the water level automatic flush cycle during his Famous` Extraordinary Pond build`thread Alan... a Marvel of engineering many feared would not work scratch

http://www.koiphen.com/forums/showthread.php?89628-Henk-Haan-s-indoor-pond-construction?s=

Henk was one of the first Koi Fora Members to incorporate an RDF which sparked my interest initially...



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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Tue Aug 09, 2011 7:47 pm

May be a coincidence but I have just recorded my first ever zero reading for ammonia. Like you Mio, I use the Exact 7. I always get <0.06 reading for ammonia. Lately, the readings has been a little higher for ammonia and nitrite whilst I have been swapping filters over and moving K1 about so I would expect a small jump.

Nitrite hit a season high of 0.4, this is down to 0.2 and falling.

Incidentally, I have looked in the Nexus this morning and noticed several hundred water snails in the 200 liers or so of water left in there with no K1. Are these beneficial the the pond environment? I would imagine they are. Should I scoop them up and put them in my bio tank?

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:13 pm

alank wrote:May be a coincidence but I have just recorded my first ever zero reading for ammonia. Like you Mio, I use the Exact 7. I always get <0.06 reading for ammonia. Lately, the readings has been a little higher for ammonia and nitrite whilst I have been swapping filters over and moving K1 about so I would expect a small jump.

Nitrite hit a season high of 0.4, this is down to 0.2 and falling.

Incidentally, I have looked in the Nexus this morning and noticed several hundred water snails in the 200 liers or so of water left in there with no K1. Are these beneficial the the pond environment? I would imagine they are. Should I scoop them up and put them in my bio tank?

Snails Shocked can be vectors for Parasites and Bacteria Alan ... I rid all my systems of therm inadvertently with Flubenol and am glad I did so...

Frequently it is IMPOSSIBLE to eradicate all of them but personally despite the alleged `benefits` I would not want them in my pond...

http://www.fishpondinfo.com/snail.htm

My Ammonia values are consistently 0.02 on the sensafe meter.

Where are you buying the reagent test strips now ? I cannot find a `basket` for checkout on the sensafe Europe site recently Alan scratch

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Tue Aug 09, 2011 10:07 pm

I phone Morris at Sensafe and buy from him.

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Tue Aug 09, 2011 10:15 pm

alank wrote:I phone Morris at Sensafe and buy from him.

Thank U Sweetie.... Very Happy

Is the Number on the Website Alan ?

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Zac Penn on Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:58 pm

alank wrote:We had sunday off as it was raining No The RDF has been running for three days now. The K1 was added to the bio chamber but modifications are needed to get it to work how I want it to. I will have to take out the whole installation to allow access to the bio tank so I can sink it 4" into the ground. When both pumps are running (51000 l/h), the water level in the chamber drops about 5" which prevents the k1 from circulating. It will be a couple of weeks before I can do this mod.


Sorry I am so late in responding to this Chichi, but I have been busy Wink

AlanK it looks like you are quite capable with fabrication, but I think you might have overlooked a simple modification that would require less work. Your SS manifold is too restrictive, and this is why the bio-tank is having such a hard time keeping its water level. If you remove the manifold, and create another flanged outlet, this should help tremendously. Here is a picture of what I am talking about...



Currently you are trying to send too much water through the thin section of the manifold and it is causing a bottle neck. Instead of lowering the bio-filter you should try this first. Much easier to do.

One way of verifying my theory is to look at the water levels inside the RDF's clear tubes. Are they dropping 4" as well or is it just in the bio-tank? If the RDF is fine, then you know it is the manifold that is causing the restriction.

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Sun Aug 14, 2011 12:05 am

Great to see you here Zac Very Happy excellent input as usual ....

Personally I would be clueless about the modifications being the DIY DID I am .... Embarassed


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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:02 am

Hi Zac, I know what you are saying but the photo is a little misleading. There are three 100 m dia inlets into 1 270 x 85 transition piece, ever so slightly smaller than the sum of 3 x 100 diameter inlets but the end pipe is almost level with the square outlet to the bio tank which is a much larger area.



The problem is the pressure drop between the 33000 l/h pump and the RDF. The drop in water level is not a problem for water flow but has more to do with the amount of water the K1 has to circulate in.

The K1 is also catching on the pump and take off tube. I have fabricated a stainless steel piece to house the 33000 l/h pump and the take off for other pumps so they are out of the flow of K1 in the bio tank. Once the tank is lowered to effectively raise the water level and therefore increase the volume of water in the tank, the K1 will "flow" up and down in the bio tank in such a way that it will not "block".

Picture shows the take off for 18000 l/h pump whick blocks K1 flow

Picture shows the take off for 33000 l/h pump whick blocks K1 flow



I have been away for a week, before going away, I replaced the 33000 l/h pump with a Sequence 18000 l/h. Even with both pumps in the bio tank, the K1 rotated in the tank faultlessly for the whole week as the drop in water level was less with the smaller pump. I take on board what you say and when I reinstall the bio tank, I will modify the transition piece to allow an additional outlet.

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by Admin on Mon Aug 22, 2011 7:35 pm

Are you pleased with the KC30 performance during the Week you were away Alan? and how are the Koi Babes now?

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Re: RDF and bio filter installation

Post by alank on Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:57 pm

Very pleased with the performance. The main thing is that I can leave the pond without worry over maintenance and daily cleaning of filters as it is all automatic.

There are two big males which seem agitated and flicking a lot. A couple of the smaller ones are twitching. There are no signs of parasites and we are on the final treatment for white spot so not sure what is going on. It may be the water temp has risen and the big boys are getting a bit frisky.

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